Sue,
You are correct about my reference to US Gallons. One of the biggest mistakes people make with goldfish, including comets and fancy goldfish, is the tank size they attempt to keep them in. A goldfish should never be in a bowl, that is simply cruel.
During my years of working at the store we kept a large display tank with semi mature fancy goldfish in it. Most of the fish in that tank were 5 - 7 inches and were raised from 2 - 3 inch babies. We sold them when they outgrew the tank and we could only get about 3 fish into that tank safely (the tank was 92 US gallons) before waste became an issue. The purpose for this display was to show our customers what fancy goldfish turn into, why they could not live in bowls. It was daily that customers would come in, find a nice fish bowl for themselves and then start picking out fancy goldfish. Rather than giving them the fish and sending them on their way, we would instead walk them to the display and ask them where they thought those fish would fit in their bowl... There were often requests for "dwarf fancy goldfish" which do not exist at this point in time, and many people who would point to the smaller ones in another tank and say "just give
me one of the little ones and it'll be fine". I was always amazed at how few people would grasp the fact that they were all the same kind of fish, just different in age.
There are some basic rules of thumb for keeping goldfish:
1. Very large tank. 1 - 2 adult fancy goldfish will need a bare minimum of 90 - 120+ gallons. 1 - 2 adult comets will need a minimum of 125+ gallons. Small/young goldfish grow very rapidly and if healthy, fancy goldfish should be at least 5 - 6 inches long within the first year or 2, comets can reach 7+ inches within the first year. Full grown, fancy goldfish average the size of a standard softball (about 8 - 9 inches in length), comets average about 14 inches in length.
2. Extra aeration. The more oxygen in the water the healthier the goldfish will be. Goldfish use more oxygen than the average aquarium fish. Cooler water temperatures also help to ensure plenty of oxygen content in the water. In over 15 yrs of working with goldfish I have found that fancy goldfish do best in temps from 65F - 72F. Comets can handle water temperatures up into the mid 70's, but long term this can cause health issues.
3. Extreme amounts of filtration and frequent water changes. Goldfish are one of the dirtiest fish in terms of eating habits and waste output. They pollute their tank water quickly. My single fancy goldfish now resides in 120 gallons, eats about 8 pellets/day and requires 2 water changes/wk to keep him clean and healthy, and will be moving to 200+ gallons soon. The current 120 gallon tank has the largest model of Aquaclear filter AND an Aqueon 55 running on the tank at all times, with carbon and sponges in the filter. The filter media needs to be cleaned at least once/wk to avoid clogging the filters.
4. Proper food. Goldfish are vegetarian, yet many people feed them high protein foods such as worms, brine/shrimp, etc. Lack of roughage in their diets can cause many digestive tract problems and can contribute to organ dysfunction/failure. Live plants such as anacharis and duck weed are great foods for goldfish and contribute to keeping the tank water clean until it is eaten, but dead plant matter should be removed quickly to avoid further polluting the water.
5. Larger gravel substrate. Goldfish like to forage for food and pick through gravel at the bottom of the tank. Especially when dealing with fancy goldfish, the larger grades of gravel are safer for the fish. Fine gravels and sands can damage the gills of the fish when they try to forage through it and can also cause problems on the belly of the fish when they slide themselves along the bottom during foraging. I have seen some very nasty bacterial infections caused this way...
As you can see, its as I tell so many people on a daily basis... goldfish are not the "easy" fish many people think they are. These fish are a lot of work to keep clean, require large amounts of space, and are one of the more difficult species to care for long term. For someone who wants "easy" there is a wide variety of tropical fish available, but I always suggest avoiding goldfish. It takes real commitment to raise them to full grown and healthy, and they have long life spans when healthy. Fancy goldfish can live up to 25 yrs and comets can live as long as 35+ yrs. My fancy goldfish is now about 5+ yrs old and has been full grown for the past 2 1/2 yrs. When people see him, even those who are familiar with goldfish... everyone asks the same question... "what is that?" Most people have never seen a full grown, healthy goldfish.
I hope this information helps.
Dawn
Dawn Moneyhan
Aquatics Specialist/Nutritionist
To learn more about me go to
http://www.helium.com/users/449334
--- On Fri, 8/27/10, suemfrancis <peterelectrician@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
From: suemfrancis <peterelectrician@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: [tropical fish club] Re: Help Lionhead goldfish
To: tropicalfishclub@yahoogroups.com
Date: Friday, August 27, 2010, 5:10 AM
Hi Dawn
I am very interested in this topic as when my son was young we had very poor success in keeping fancy goldfish.
Could you confirm that the gallons you mention are US Gallons and not imperial.
I have done some US Gallon conversion to litres and it seems that Goldifsh need very large tanks which is where I am sure I went wrong all those years ago. If this is the case it is criminal for Fish Shops to sell very tiny tanks and bowls to keep them in!!
Sue Francis
Surrey, England.
--- In tropicalfishclub@yahoogroups.com, Dawn Moneyhan <dawnshungryeyes4u2c@...> wrote:
>
> Sasi,
> I calculated the measurements you gave me, and I am still guessing at the tank volume because you did not include the height in the measurements. From the sounds of it, the smaller tank is approximately 15 - 20 gallons and the larger tank is approximately 30 - 45 gallons. However they figure out with height, any of those tanks is far too small to raise goldfish in a healthy way.Â
>
> Knowing that the 2 fish became ill after moving them to the smaller tank now makes much more sense, considering the size/volume of the tank. As much as I hate to say it, no matter what treatment you use for these fish, keeping them in that size of a tank is going to bring further health issues until they die. There is no way to raise 2 healthy fancy goldfish to adulthood in such small conditions.
>
> Please be aware, the epsom salt will only treat the fish that is floating upside down, and that also will only be a temporary fix to the problem if the fish remain in such a small tank. As I stated in my last post, the issues with swim bladder problems tend to come from bacterial infections (internal) and dirty water (which leads to bacterial infections).Â
>
> For 15 - 20 gallons of water, I would suggest 3 tablespoons of epsom salt. Here are a couple of links to what you need, please let me know if you still have a problem in getting it.
>
> http://www.walgreens.com/store/catalog/Joint-and-Muscle-Pain/Epsom-Salt/ID=prod5934776-product
>
> http://www.saltworks.us/epsom-salt.html
>
> http://www.drugstore.com/qxp80249_333181_sespider/rite_aid/epsom_salt.htm
>
> If you are not in the USA I can help try to find it for you online available in your country, but I would first need to know what country and what part of that country you are in. I would be more than happy to look it up for you and provide you with further links.
>
> Unfortunately, the only real long term solution to your problem is to get those fish into a much larger tank...
>
> You did not mention what the water temp is in your tank, but I would suggest keeping it between 65F - 72F (18.33C - 22.22C), especially while the fish are ill. The cooler water temperature will help them to heal faster and will help ensure they have plenty of oxygen content in their tank water.
>
> The only other suggestion I can make at this time is to start daily water changes to ensure the water quality is in very good condition. 10 - 15% each day will help a lot, especially if you do a gravel vac during each change to help avoid any build up of organics. Goldfish are one of the dirtiest fish there are, they pass an extremely high amount of waste in comparison to most other fish. Carbon in the filter should be changed about every 20 - 30 days to be sure it is able to continue absorbing the heavy waste of the fish. If you can accomplish all of this, those fish should begin to grow again, and at a very rapid rate... so now is the time to begin searching for a much larger tank.
>
> Best of luck to you and your fish!
>
> Dawn
>
>
>
>
>
> Dawn Moneyhan
> Aquatics Specialist/Nutritionist
> To learn more about me go to
> http://www.helium.com/users/449334
>
>
>
> --- On Thu, 8/26/10, sashi r <sashi_bs@...> wrote:
>
> From: sashi r <sashi_bs@...>
> Subject: [tropical fish club] Re: Help Lionhead goldfish
> To: tropicalfishclub@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, August 26, 2010, 5:44 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Â
>
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> Hi,
>
> The tank is 60cms length and 25 cms wide and is made of glass.
>
> The epsom salt is not available in the pharma I live at.
>
> I will buy it online..
>
> Pls give me the treatment dose of epsom salt.
>
> I also have 90 cms length and 30 cms wide glass tank which I actually bought for this lionhead goldfish but the other fishes started troubling them so I took these away from it and kept in 2 ft tank and after introducting them in 2ft tank only they started getting sick..
>
> Thanks for everyone in our group who helped me giving direction on treatment.
>
> Last time I asked for help to save my sick fighter fish and it died after few hrs I sent to group but this time i have chance to save my goldfish.
>
> Sasi
>
>
>
> --- In tropicalfishclub@yahoogroups.com, Dawn Moneyhan <dawnshungryeyes4u2c@> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > Can you be any more specific on tank size please? Or include full dimensions of the tank (length, width, height)? A "2 ft tank" could be 15, 20, 25, or 30 gallons. I will need to know the size of the tank to advise on how much epsom salts you will need to use. If you cannot find the epsom salts locally they can be purchased online at walgreens.com or any other pharmacy store. Be sure it says 100% pure epsom salt, you don't want anything that has additives in it.
>
> >
>
> > Regardless of what size this tank turns out to be... I can assure you that none of those tanks I listed above is large enough for 2 fancy goldfish. That is very likely where your biggest problem is coming from in stunting growth and keeping water quality healthy. 2 small fancy goldfish should start in at least 55 gallons or more, and should be moved to a much larger tank as they continue to grow to adult size.ÂÂ
>
> >
>
> > If its of any comfort to you, I have successfully nursed many goldfish back to health after they suffered the same kind of situations as you have now. Tumors CAN go away without the use of medications, but it does take some time. Growth can return to normal if the water quality is in great shape and the fish have a large enough tank. The last goldfish I took in is the one I still have now, his name is Freddy. When I took him he was about 2 yrs old and only about 2 inches long. He came with another goldfish, a ryukin that was covered in tumors. After going into a larger tank (75 gallons) and keeping water quality in perfect condition with lots of water changes and extra filtration, carbon in the filter, air stones, etc. the ryukin's tumors began to shrink and were gone completely within 6 months, and Freddy began to grow again. Now at over 5 yrs old, Freddy is almost 9 inches long and
lives in a 120 gallon tank alone... and
> needs a larger
>
> > tank still. The ryukin lived for 2 yrs before it died. When I did the necropsy on the ryukin I found extensive internal damage that was the actual cause of death (organ failure)... but that fish was in much worse condition than yours appears to be.ÂÂ
>
> >
>
> > If you fix the problems now, before things get worse, there is every reason to expect your outcome could be the same as I've had with Freddy... a happy, healthy, full grown fish.
>
> >
>
> > Dawn
>
> >
>
> > Dawn Moneyhan
>
> > Aquatics Specialist/Nutritionist
>
> > To learn more about me go to
>
> > http://www.helium.com/users/449334
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > --- On Thu, 8/26/10, sashi r <sashi_bs@> wrote:
>
> >
>
> > From: sashi r <sashi_bs@>
>
> > Subject: [tropical fish club] Re: Help Lionhead goldfish
>
> > To: tropicalfishclub@yahoogroups.com
>
> > Date: Thursday, August 26, 2010, 9:26 AM
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> > Hi
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> >
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> > I am changing water every 4 days i got 2 ft tank where only this 2 fishes are kept. I couldnt get epsom salt in shops so pls advice for alternativ of epsom salt for treatment
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