I am really surprised and disturbed by the advice given in this thread where goldfish are concerned. (with the exception of John, who I know has goldfish and learned the hard way over the yrs about putting them into small tanks) 20 gallons is NOT ok for a goldfish, nor is 30 gallons. If we are talking about humane treatment of the fish then their adult size, rapid growth rate, messy eating habits, and high levels of waste need to all be taken into account. I know I have mentioned my Freddy before in this group but for those who are new or may have forgotten, please let me reiterate for you.
Freddy was an oranda/ryukin mix fancy goldfish. I rescued him from a 37 gallon tank when he was about 3 yrs old, alongside of another ryukin fancy goldfish, also about 3 yrs old. The other fish was covered in tumors to a point it could barely swim and it was blind. Both were severely stunted and Freddy had a bad bacterial infection. This happened because they were forced to live in a small tank for years without the proper care or food.
I didn't expect either fish to live more than a day or 2. The one with the tumors lasted just over a year and all of the tumors went away, but it required hand feeding so it could find the food. All I did for it was give it a larger tank and plenty of clean water and proper food. The internal damage I found when it died was enough to make anyone sick.
Freddy lived for over 6 yrs and once in a proper size tank began to grow again, reaching full adult size for a fancy goldfish... 9 inches long and as big around as a softball. Anything less than a 120 gallon tank by that point was too small and he would get sick quickly, and eventually he outgrew that, too. Eating 8 - 10 pellets/day and having anacharis in the tank as well as duck weed to munch on and to help with water quality, and that 120 gallon tank with 2 filters still required daily water changes to keep him healthy.
The point is, goldfish get large and are one of the dirtiest fish out there. They are one of the hardest fish to care for because they require so much space and so much maintenance. Confining even a single goldfish to a 20 or 30 gallon tank is a death sentence filled with suffering.
I'm sorry if my post offends anyone but to be quite blunt about it, the info being posted here about goldfish offends and upsets me. The average lifespan of a fancy goldfish is 25 yrs, for a comet it is 35 yrs... so before anyone jumps in to insist I am wrong because they kept a goldfish in a small tank and it lived 3 - 5 yrs... keep in mind that only means another baby fish was killed needlessly.
There was a time many yrs ago when this was common practice, as was goldfish in bowls. I like to think we in the fish world have learned something since then and will stop promoting such cruelty. Everyone would have a fit if someone suggested raising an oscar to adulthood in a 20 or 30 gallon tank. Comet goldfish get to the same size range as an oscar and are equally as dirty, and fancy goldfish, by the time you count in the fins, get almost as large and are still equally as dirty.
Sorry for the rant but I couldn't let this go. Spreading that kind of misinformation around only hurts more innocent fish and I am just sick of watching it happen.
Lastly, I want to thank Denise for standing up for those pet store employees who DO know what they are talking about and doing. While they are getting to be a rarity, they do still exist. Anyone who has the ability to visit Big Al's would get a treat to work with those employees. I also worked for a store where education was constant and a job requirement and most of the staff held college degrees along with many years of experience in the aquatic industry. Aquatic biologist, vet tech, botanist, etc. were all part of our staff. Seminars and school were a weekly requirement just to keep our jobs. Giving out bad information meant getting fired. It was a thankless job and the reason we were all there is because we cared so deeply about the animals. Most of the problems were the customers who came in asking for "no maintenance fish" or wanting to put "nemo in a bowl" or use angelfish as feeders for their pet piranha. Customers often neglect to ask questions and more often argue with the staff about who is right vs who is wrong because they don't like to hear the honest truth or be told that something can't/won't work. I could tell horror stories that would make people's heads spin to hear them... like the lady who bought 10 cardinal tetras every week for her 10 gallon tank, insisting that "any idiot knows they only live a week and then you buy more". Please don't generalize all pet store employees as bad, they are not all bad.
Dawn
--- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "reneap7040" <begotten65@...> wrote:
>
> One goldfish can grow to a foot,or more,within a couple of years.So one goldfish needs min.20gal.to grow in.
> 2 goldfish can do with 30gal. and 3 can do with 40 ,and so forth.Also you will need filters and all that stuf.Rene'
>
> --- In AquaticLife@yahoogroups.com, "kezzabeast" <kagedkez@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> > I was recently ripped off by an independent retailer (1 gallon bowl, 2 goldfish, hence 1 died within 48 hours, returned to shop, false info from them initially)
> > I will be getting a 30litre bioOrb donated from a friend as i would love to have some fish in the house.
> > I was initially looking at Betta's, but I have just read its hard to keep them together and they can be aggressive.
> >
> > What would you recommend? I am looking to get two or three fish if possible. I will not be getting goldfish again. I have two children, (6 and 7) so something suitable for them and that will capture their interest.
> >
> > I want to make sure this time that i am doing this properly and offering the fish good life.
> >
> > Any advice appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Kez
> >
>
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